Implementation of coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory getRuntimeService()?

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).
getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently
missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the
process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or
making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of
the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For
compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and
Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the server level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable: http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/

It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}
Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :slight_smile:
On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (@Tony_Junkes) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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This is regarding code that’s in Taffy’s api.cfc

This cropped up when someone else ran into the issue. I did some testing and reported back to Adam about this in regards and have just been inquiring to try and close in on a solution until he gets a moment to look at it as well.

I’m not sure what the history is of this not working anymore in Lucee (do you know from what version onwards it’s breaking — is it the 5.x branch only?), but from glancing over it, I’d agree with your opinion that Taffy’s use is reasonable and having to use cfadmin is not great.

However — the ServiceFactory was never official and Railo’s provisioning of it was to keep compatibility going. From that point of view and the goal to clean up certain things in the “new Lucee language”, I’d generally not rely on this object to be there.

Could either of you raise a ticket for this please?

Cheers
Kai> On 14/08/2015, at 5:36 pm, Adam Tuttle <@Adam_Tuttle> wrote:

Taffy uses this factory to determine if there is a server level /resources mapping. It’s part of a method used to find the resources the developer is defining, which could be in a variety of locations.

For more context, see the function guessResourcesPath, here: https://github.com/atuttle/Taffy/blob/master/core/api.cfc#L928

But my position is this:

  • It exists and works in current supported versions ACF
  • It existed and worked in Railo
  • It existed and worked in earlier versions of Lucee

Therefore, if you’re going to remove functionality from the platform, shouldn’t you provide another reasonable way to accomplish the same goal?

For Taffy’s purposes, asking for a CF Admin password is simply unacceptable.

In my opinion, the burden is on Lucee to justify why it was removed, rather than on the community to justify why it’s needed. Even if that were not the case, in my opinion, Taffy’s usage is a reasonable and clear justification.

On Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 3:18:38 PM UTC-4, Jon Clausen wrote:
Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the server level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable: http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/ http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/
It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}
Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :slight_smile:

On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (tonyj...@gmail.com <javascript:>) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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Hi Adam,

I wanted to check the source code history to see where it stopped working. Unfortunately, I can not find a working version…

The Lucee source file in question is: https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/master/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
The oldest commit in the Lucee GitHub repo is named “inital commit”: https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/b582cd1f3286f16eb1a4fea7d1d3774815c0476e/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L56-L58

The Railo source on github has an initial version dated june 24, 2009: https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/99e969e528c6f5a9f726a229879a5e16a3112bdb/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L40-L42

In all those cases, it threw the “missingService” exception. Are you sure it worked in Railo and Lucee?

Kind regards,

Paul Klinkenberg

Taffy uses this factory to determine if there is a server level /resources mapping. It’s part of a method used to find the resources the developer is defining, which could be in a variety of locations.

For more context, see the function guessResourcesPath, here: https://github.com/atuttle/Taffy/blob/master/core/api.cfc#L928

But my position is this:

  • It exists and works in current supported versions ACF
  • It existed and worked in Railo
  • It existed and worked in earlier versions of Lucee

Therefore, if you’re going to remove functionality from the platform, shouldn’t you provide another reasonable way to accomplish the same goal?

For Taffy’s purposes, asking for a CF Admin password is simply unacceptable.

In my opinion, the burden is on Lucee to justify why it was removed, rather than on the community to justify why it’s needed. Even if that were not the case, in my opinion, Taffy’s usage is a reasonable and clear justification.

Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the server level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable: http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/ http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/
It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}
Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :)Op 14 aug. 2015, om 17:36 heeft Adam Tuttle <@Adam_Tuttle> het volgende geschreven:
On Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 3:18:38 PM UTC-4, Jon Clausen wrote:

On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (tonyj...@gmail.com <javascript:>) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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Taffy uses this factory to determine if there is a server level /resources
mapping. It’s part of a method used to find the resources the developer is
defining, which could be in a variety of locations.

For more context, see the function guessResourcesPath,
here: https://github.com/atuttle/Taffy/blob/master/core/api.cfc#L928

But my position is this:

  • It exists and works in current supported versions ACF
  • It existed and worked in Railo
  • It existed and worked in earlier versions of Lucee

Therefore, if you’re going to remove functionality from the platform,
shouldn’t you provide another reasonable way to accomplish the same goal?

For Taffy’s purposes, asking for a CF Admin password is simply unacceptable.

In my opinion, the burden is on Lucee to justify why it was removed, rather
than on the community to justify why it’s needed. Even if that were not the
case, in my opinion, Taffy’s usage is a reasonable and clear justification.On Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 3:18:38 PM UTC-4, Jon Clausen wrote:

Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the server
level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable:
http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/

It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking
for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}

Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :slight_smile:

On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (tonyj...@gmail.com <javascript:>) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).
getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently
missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the
process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or
making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of
the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For
compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and
Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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The question this raises to me is:

Should Lucee (even though it only be in the CFML compatibility layer) provide an undocumented functionality that even ACF doesn’t provide “officially”?

Or shouldn’t Lucee instead provide properly documented and supported functionality to achieve some of the things that the ServiceFactory provides through the backdoor instead?

Cheers
Kai> On 15/08/2015, at 5:17 am, Tony Junkes <@Tony_Junkes> wrote:

I’ll admit, when I’ve toyed with Taffy it’s been on ACF. I’ve never used it in production (which would be Lucee and Railo before it). Though, I thought I remembered the ServiceFactory object existing in some version of Railo; though, I could be wrong.

With that said, I went ahead and briefly tested Taffy (3.0.2) against a handful of express versions. See the list below.

Railo 4.2.1.008
Lucee 4.5.0.042
Lucee 4.5.1.023
Lucee 5.0.0.49

In my findings, all of them threw an error in regards to the use of the ServiceFactory object with a suggestion in the stack trace to use as a workaround. Upon removing this check in api.cfc, all seemed to work. It’s surprising that only one person has spoken out about the issue through all of these Railo/Lucee versions (so far?).

I think, in this situation, it’s worth filing a bug/feature request asking for, at least, partial functionality of ServiceFactory to be implemented. I’ll go ahead and do that.

Cheers.


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I’m not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with mappings.
Interesting.On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the resources are
defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be
sufficient to determine whether resources had been defined via any means?

I’ll admit, when I’ve toyed with Taffy it’s been on ACF. I’ve never used it
in production (which would be Lucee and Railo before it). Though, I thought
I remembered the ServiceFactory object existing in some version of Railo;
though, I could be wrong.

With that said, I went ahead and briefly tested Taffy (3.0.2) against a
handful of *express *versions. See the list below.

Railo 4.2.1.008
Lucee 4.5.0.042
Lucee 4.5.1.023
Lucee 5.0.0.49

In my findings, all of them threw an error in regards to the use of the
ServiceFactory object with a suggestion in the stack trace to use
as a workaround. Upon removing this check in api.cfc, all seemed to work.
It’s surprising that only one person has spoken out about the issue through
all of these Railo/Lucee versions (so far?).

I think, in this situation, it’s worth filing a bug/feature request
asking for, at least, partial functionality of ServiceFactory to be
implemented. I’ll go ahead and do that.

Cheers.

I def have similar thoughts.

I’m thinking certain parts of cfadmin should be opened up as an object of functions carrying out the similar tasks it already does; but from a read only view. If certain info is to be deemed sensitive from even a read only standpoint, make the server/web context password a required parameter.

I don’t know how sensitive some might feel this info to be, but from a framework developers perspective, I think it makes sense to make info like mappings and similar info available to view for config/environment setup etc.

> I don’t have time to setup a Lucee environment and run the tests

You can run the Taffy tests in Lucee via CommandBox in a matter of seconds
with the following commands:

CommandBox> install git://github.com/atuttle/Taffy.git
CommandBox> install mxunit
CommandBox> start --!openbrowser
CommandBox> server open /taffy/tests
CommandBox> server open /taffy/tests/tests

They are currently throwing the error you reported in this thread
(getRuntimeService).

+1 to Jon C’s suggestion of getApplicationSettings() as a work around.

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the resources are
defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be
sufficient to determine whether resources had been defined via any means?

Regarding where they stopped working in Lucee, I can’t say-- I’ve never
tried to use it. Railo/Lucee has provided several “undocumented” APIs
before (like sessionfactory) just because they’re popular. If it worked
before and not now, it’s possible it was an accidental regression. Based on
what Paul K says though, it makes me question if it ever worked.

Thanks!

~BradOn Friday, August 14, 2015 at 8:37:35 PM UTC-5, Adam Tuttle wrote:

To the best of my knowledge, yes, it worked on Railo and earlier versions
(though I don’t know specifics, sorry) of Lucee.

The code in question was contributed in April of this year, and I know
we’ve got quite a few people using Taffy on Lucee. I imagine if it were
broken for them they’d have spoken up.

I don’t have time to setup a Lucee environment and run the tests,
unfortunately (I shouldn’t even be taking the time to write this email…)

Adam

On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 4:06:57 PM UTC-4, Paul Klinkenberg wrote:

Hi Adam,

I wanted to check the source code history to see where it stopped
working. Unfortunately, I can not find a working version…

The Lucee source file in question is:
https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/master/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
The oldest commit in the Lucee GitHub repo is named “inital commit”:
https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/b582cd1f3286f16eb1a4fea7d1d3774815c0476e/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L56-L58

The Railo source on github has an initial version dated june 24, 2009
:
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/99e969e528c6f5a9f726a229879a5e16a3112bdb/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L40-L42

In all those cases, it threw the “missingService” exception. Are you sure
it worked in Railo and Lucee?

Kind regards,

Paul Klinkenberg

Op 14 aug. 2015, om 17:36 heeft Adam Tuttle ad...@fusiongrokker.com het volgende geschreven:

Taffy uses this factory to determine if there is a server level
/resources mapping. It’s part of a method used to find the resources the
developer is defining, which could be in a variety of locations.

For more context, see the function guessResourcesPath, here:
https://github.com/atuttle/Taffy/blob/master/core/api.cfc#L928

But my position is this:

  • It exists and works in current supported versions ACF
  • It existed and worked in Railo
  • It existed and worked in earlier versions of Lucee

Therefore, if you’re going to remove functionality from the platform,
shouldn’t you provide another reasonable way to accomplish the same goal?

For Taffy’s purposes, asking for a CF Admin password is simply
unacceptable.

In my opinion, the burden is on Lucee to justify why it was removed,
rather than on the community to justify why it’s needed. Even if that were
not the case, in my opinion, Taffy’s usage is a reasonable and clear
justification.

On Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 3:18:38 PM UTC-4, Jon Clausen wrote:

Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the
server level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable:
http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/

It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking
for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}

Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :slight_smile:

On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (tonyj...@gmail.com) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).
getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently
missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but
the process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or
making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of
the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For
compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and
Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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To the best of my knowledge, yes, it worked on Railo and earlier versions
(though I don’t know specifics, sorry) of Lucee.

The code in question was contributed in April of this year, and I know
we’ve got quite a few people using Taffy on Lucee. I imagine if it were
broken for them they’d have spoken up.

I don’t have time to setup a Lucee environment and run the tests,
unfortunately (I shouldn’t even be taking the time to write this email…)

AdamOn Friday, August 14, 2015 at 4:06:57 PM UTC-4, Paul Klinkenberg wrote:

Hi Adam,

I wanted to check the source code history to see where it stopped working.
Unfortunately, I can not find a working version…

The Lucee source file in question is:
https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/master/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
The oldest commit in the Lucee GitHub repo is named “inital commit”:
https://github.com/lucee/Lucee4/blob/b582cd1f3286f16eb1a4fea7d1d3774815c0476e/lucee-java/lucee-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L56-L58

The Railo source on github has an initial version dated june 24, 2009
:
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/99e969e528c6f5a9f726a229879a5e16a3112bdb/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java#L40-L42

In all those cases, it threw the “missingService” exception. Are you sure
it worked in Railo and Lucee?

Kind regards,

Paul Klinkenberg

Op 14 aug. 2015, om 17:36 heeft Adam Tuttle <ad...@fusiongrokker.com <javascript:>> het volgende geschreven:

Taffy uses this factory to determine if there is a server level /resources
mapping. It’s part of a method used to find the resources the developer is
defining, which could be in a variety of locations.

For more context, see the function guessResourcesPath, here:
https://github.com/atuttle/Taffy/blob/master/core/api.cfc#L928

But my position is this:

  • It exists and works in current supported versions ACF
  • It existed and worked in Railo
  • It existed and worked in earlier versions of Lucee

Therefore, if you’re going to remove functionality from the platform,
shouldn’t you provide another reasonable way to accomplish the same goal?

For Taffy’s purposes, asking for a CF Admin password is simply
unacceptable.

In my opinion, the burden is on Lucee to justify why it was removed,
rather than on the community to justify why it’s needed. Even if that were
not the case, in my opinion, Taffy’s usage is a reasonable and clear
justification.

On Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 3:18:38 PM UTC-4, Jon Clausen wrote:

Is there a specific reason your taffy mappings need to exist at the
server level? Their docs show that App-level mappings are acceptable:
http://docs.taffy.io/3.0.0/

It’s much easier to handle those mappings at the app level and checking
for them is as simple as a structKeyExists().

if(!structKeyExists(getApplicationSettings().mappings,’/mymapping’)){

}

Server-level mappings seems so… 2008. :slight_smile:

On July 22, 2015 at 1:51:07 PM, Tony Junkes (tonyj...@gmail.com) wrote:

The code below runs in ACF,

writeDump( createObject(“java”, “coldfusion.server.ServiceFactory”).
getRuntimeService().getMappings() );

In Lucee it results in: “the service [RuntimeService] is currently
missing. At the moment you can use cfadmin tag instead”

I’ve found the way to get similar results using the tag but the
process is a bit more involved since it either requires a password or
making read access open from the admin.

Is there a reason why this hasn’t been implemented similar to ACF?

The reason I ask is currently, the Taffy REST framework is making use of
the above object creation to check if a server-level mapping exists. For
compatibility reasons, this would be ideal to have available from ACF and
Lucee unless there’s another method that I’m not aware of.

Cheers.

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Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists() suggestion,
and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we’ll be switching to that.

To directly answer your question about “it only taking a few seconds in
commandbox” ~~ that would require having CB installed and being familiar
enough with it to (a) know that and (b) know what to do from there – and I
have neither of those things (until now, which solves A). Don’t forget that
as programmers once we’ve done/mastered something, we tend to think of it
as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for those that haven’t mastered
it yet.

Also I’m working 14 hour days through the end of August to meet a deadline,
so no, I don’t have time to play with CommandBox.

So, I guess, for now… immediate problem solved. But as Kai has pointed
out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee supported functionality like
this (and others) in some supported way.

AdamOn Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the resources are
defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be
sufficient to determine whether resources had been defined via any means?

I’m not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with mappings.
Interesting.

First of all Lucee nor Railo never supported
this (serviceFactory.getRuntimeService).
Check out the Railo source

Our politic about this always was, if there is a high demand we implement
also undocumented functionality. We did for example a lot of undocumented
functionality back in the days when “Transfer” was popular, transfer has
used a lot of undocumented functionality. But if something is not requested
or there is an other way to do it we will not do it.
It is part of the base architecture of Lucee that you cannot change
persistent setting without having a password, we have no plans to change
that fact. Change this would be a security concern.

MichaAm Sonntag, 16. August 2015 schrieb Adam Tuttle :

Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists() suggestion,
and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we’ll be switching to that.

To directly answer your question about “it only taking a few seconds in
commandbox” ~~ that would require having CB installed and being familiar
enough with it to (a) know that and (b) know what to do from there – and I
have neither of those things (until now, which solves A). Don’t forget that
as programmers once we’ve done/mastered something, we tend to think of it
as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for those that haven’t mastered
it yet.

Also I’m working 14 hour days through the end of August to meet a
deadline, so no, I don’t have time to play with CommandBox.

So, I guess, for now… immediate problem solved. But as Kai has pointed
out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee supported functionality like
this (and others) in some supported way.

Adam

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the resources are
defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be
sufficient to determine whether resources had been defined via any means?

I’m not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with mappings.
Interesting.


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Micha, nobody is asking for the ability to change mappings. Only to
enumerate them.

AdamOn Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 12:51:04 PM UTC-4, Micha wrote:

First of all Lucee nor Railo never supported
this (serviceFactory.getRuntimeService).
Check out the Railo source

https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java

Our politic about this always was, if there is a high demand we implement
also undocumented functionality. We did for example a lot of undocumented
functionality back in the days when “Transfer” was popular, transfer has
used a lot of undocumented functionality. But if something is not requested
or there is an other way to do it we will not do it.
It is part of the base architecture of Lucee that you cannot change
persistent setting without having a password, we have no plans to change
that fact. Change this would be a security concern.

Micha

Am Sonntag, 16. August 2015 schrieb Adam Tuttle :

Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists() suggestion,
and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we’ll be switching to that.

To directly answer your question about “it only taking a few seconds in
commandbox” ~~ that would require having CB installed and being familiar
enough with it to (a) know that and (b) know what to do from there – and I
have neither of those things (until now, which solves A). Don’t forget that
as programmers once we’ve done/mastered something, we tend to think of it
as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for those that haven’t mastered
it yet.

Also I’m working 14 hour days through the end of August to meet a
deadline, so no, I don’t have time to play with CommandBox.

So, I guess, for now… immediate problem solved. But as Kai has pointed
out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee supported functionality like
this (and others) in some supported way.

Adam

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the resources are
defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be
sufficient to determine whether resources had been defined via any means?

I’m not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with mappings.
Interesting.


See Lucee at CFCamp Oct 22 & 23 2015 @ Munich Airport, Germany - Get your
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You can do
getApplicationSettings() (Lucee/Railo only)
getApplicationMetadata() (Lucee/Railo and ACF)

and you have a mappings key so you can do

getApplicationMetadata().mappings.keyExists(’/mapping’);

and of course, if you don’t have to have a list but just check it’s there:

DirectoryExists("/mapping") (as has been said before)

HTH

MD

Adam Tuttle wrote:>

Micha, nobody is asking for the ability to change mappings. Only to
enumerate them.

Adam

On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 12:51:04 PM UTC-4, Micha wrote:

First of all Lucee nor Railo never supported
this (serviceFactory.getRuntimeService).
Check out the Railo source
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java

Our politic about this always was, if there is a high demand we
implement also undocumented functionality. We did for example a
lot of undocumented functionality back in the days when “Transfer”
was popular, transfer has used a lot of undocumented
functionality. But if something is not requested or there is an
other way to do it we will not do it.
It is part of the base architecture of Lucee that you cannot
change persistent setting without having a password, we have no
plans to change that fact. Change this would be a security concern.

Micha

Am Sonntag, 16. August 2015 schrieb Adam Tuttle :

Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists()
suggestion, and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we’ll be
switching to that.

To directly answer your question about “it only taking a few
seconds in commandbox” ~~ that would require having CB
installed and being familiar enough with it to (a) know that
and (b) know what to do from there – and I have neither of
those things (until now, which solves A). Don’t forget that as
programmers once we’ve done/mastered something, we tend to
think of it as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for
those that haven’t mastered it yet.

Also I’m working 14 hour days through the end of August to
meet a deadline, so no, I don’t have time to play with CommandBox.

So, I guess, for now… immediate problem solved. But as Kai
has pointed out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee
supported functionality like this (and others) in some
supported way.

Adam

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:

And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the
resources are defined as a mapping at all? Wouldn’t
directoryExists( ‘/resources’ ) be sufficient to
determine whether resources had been defined via any
means?

I’m not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with
mappings. Interesting.


See Lucee at CFCamp Oct 22 & 23 2015 @ Munich Airport, Germany


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Mark, does getApplicationMetadata() return server-level mappings? That’s
what we’re after in this case.

As I’ve already mentioned, Taffy is (and has already) converted to use
directoryExists for this purpose; so we DON’T need this for Taffy support.
But that said, I continue to believe this is a valuable asset for the
platform to have.

That’s my last word on it. Add it or don’t. I’ve made my case and I tire of
repeating myself.

Have a wonderful day, everyone.

AdamOn Monday, August 17, 2015 at 8:22:52 AM UTC-4, Mark Drew wrote:

You can do
getApplicationSettings() (Lucee/Railo only)
getApplicationMetadata() (Lucee/Railo and ACF)

and you have a mappings key so you can do

getApplicationMetadata().mappings.keyExists(’/mapping’);

and of course, if you don’t have to have a list but just check it’s there:

DirectoryExists("/mapping") (as has been said before)

HTH

MD

Adam Tuttle wrote:

Micha, nobody is asking for the ability to change mappings. Only to
enumerate them.

Adam

On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 12:51:04 PM UTC-4, Micha wrote:

First of all Lucee nor Railo never supported
this (serviceFactory.getRuntimeService).
Check out the Railo source

https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
<
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java

Our politic about this always was, if there is a high demand we
implement also undocumented functionality. We did for example a
lot of undocumented functionality back in the days when "Transfer"
was popular, transfer has used a lot of undocumented
functionality. But if something is not requested or there is an
other way to do it we will not do it.
It is part of the base architecture of Lucee that you cannot
change persistent setting without having a password, we have no
plans to change that fact. Change this would be a security concern.

Micha

Am Sonntag, 16. August 2015 schrieb Adam Tuttle :

    Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists()
    suggestion, and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we'll be
    switching to that.

    To directly answer your question about "it only taking a few
    seconds in commandbox" ~~ that would require having CB
    installed and being familiar enough with it to (a) know that
    and (b) know what to do from there -- and I have neither of
    those things (until now, which solves A). Don't forget that as
    programmers once we've done/mastered something, we tend to
    think of it as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for
    those that haven't mastered it yet.

    Also I'm working 14 hour days through the end of August to
    meet a deadline, so no, I don't have time to play with CommandBox.

    So, I guess, for now... immediate problem solved. But as Kai
    has pointed out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee
    supported functionality like this (and others) in some
    supported way.

    Adam

    On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

        On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:


            And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the
            resources are defined as a mapping at all?  Wouldn't
            directoryExists( '/resources' ) be sufficient to
            determine whether resources had been defined via any
            means?



        I'm not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with
        mappings. Interesting.

    -- 
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    - Get your ticket NOW - http://www.cfcamp.org/
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Adam Tuttle wrote:

Mark, does getApplicationMetadata() return server-level mappings?
That’s what we’re after in this case.
You are right, it only returns Per-Application settings rather than
server or web settings. You are right, that should be something you can
do as an app developer.

Glad directoryExists() works for your use case.

MD

I think this is a Lucee-only thing, it’s worth nothing there is a “Access
Read” and “Access Write” setting in the admin under “Security > Access”
which will allow read-only access via the cfadmin tag. It defaults to
“password protected” but also allows “open” and 'closed". I think I had to
use that to get Transfer ORM working on Lucee recently.

Thanks!

~Brad

ColdBox Platform Evangelist
*Ortus Solutions, Corp *

E-mail: brad@coldbox.org
ColdBox Platform: http://www.coldbox.org
Blog: http://www.codersrevolution.comOn Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Adam Tuttle <@Adam_Tuttle> wrote:

Mark, does getApplicationMetadata() return server-level mappings? That’s
what we’re after in this case.

As I’ve already mentioned, Taffy is (and has already) converted to use
directoryExists for this purpose; so we DON’T need this for Taffy support.
But that said, I continue to believe this is a valuable asset for the
platform to have.

That’s my last word on it. Add it or don’t. I’ve made my case and I tire
of repeating myself.

Have a wonderful day, everyone.

Adam

On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 8:22:52 AM UTC-4, Mark Drew wrote:

You can do
getApplicationSettings() (Lucee/Railo only)
getApplicationMetadata() (Lucee/Railo and ACF)

and you have a mappings key so you can do

getApplicationMetadata().mappings.keyExists(’/mapping’);

and of course, if you don’t have to have a list but just check it’s there:

DirectoryExists("/mapping") (as has been said before)

HTH

MD

Adam Tuttle wrote:

Micha, nobody is asking for the ability to change mappings. Only to
enumerate them.

Adam

On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 12:51:04 PM UTC-4, Micha wrote:

First of all Lucee nor Railo never supported
this (serviceFactory.getRuntimeService).
Check out the Railo source

https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java
<
https://github.com/getrailo/railo/blob/master/railo-java/railo-core/src/coldfusion/server/ServiceFactory.java

Our politic about this always was, if there is a high demand we
implement also undocumented functionality. We did for example a
lot of undocumented functionality back in the days when "Transfer"
was popular, transfer has used a lot of undocumented
functionality. But if something is not requested or there is an
other way to do it we will not do it.
It is part of the base architecture of Lucee that you cannot
change persistent setting without having a password, we have no
plans to change that fact. Change this would be a security concern.

Micha

Am Sonntag, 16. August 2015 schrieb Adam Tuttle :

    Tony caught up with me elsewhere about the directoryExists()
    suggestion, and I like it. Thanks, Brad. I think we'll be
    switching to that.

    To directly answer your question about "it only taking a few
    seconds in commandbox" ~~ that would require having CB
    installed and being familiar enough with it to (a) know that
    and (b) know what to do from there -- and I have neither of
    those things (until now, which solves A). Don't forget that as
    programmers once we've done/mastered something, we tend to
    think of it as fast and easy, when in reality it is not for
    those that haven't mastered it yet.

    Also I'm working 14 hour days through the end of August to
    meet a deadline, so no, I don't have time to play with CommandBox.

    So, I guess, for now... immediate problem solved. But as Kai
    has pointed out multiple times, it would be nice if Lucee
    supported functionality like this (and others) in some
    supported way.

    Adam

    On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 11:48:52 AM UTC-4, Tony Junkes wrote:

        On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 9:51:06 AM UTC-4, Brad Wood wrote:


            And to suggest another, why does it matter whether the
            resources are defined as a mapping at all?  Wouldn't
            directoryExists( '/resources' ) be sufficient to
            determine whether resources had been defined via any
            means?



        I'm not sure I was aware that directoryExists() works with
        mappings. Interesting.

    --
    See Lucee at CFCamp Oct 22 & 23 2015 @ Munich Airport, Germany
    - Get your ticket NOW - http://www.cfcamp.org/
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If’s it just going to be an alias, it should be fixed just for ACF compatOn Tuesday, 18 August 2015 01:57:00 UTC+10, Mark Drew wrote:

Adam Tuttle wrote:

Mark, does getApplicationMetadata() return server-level mappings?
That’s what we’re after in this case.
You are right, it only returns Per-Application settings rather than
server or web settings. You are right, that should be something you can
do as an app developer.

Glad directoryExists() works for your use case.

MD